Ditto, thanks Tracy, very useful info. I guess we should look into AKAN's color choices.
What got me confused are pics of Tsesarevich from Port Arthur and Qingdao, directly before and after the Battle, which clearly show 2 tone hull, one on the armored belt, and other above that. Since we know that Imperial Russian Navy did not paint the boot-topping on their ships at the time, could this color on the armored belt be the anti-fouling, lower hull red or green?
See these pics (oh, which could also be used as a template for rigging, so we keep in topic )
----== The eternal mistake of mankind is to set an attainable ideal ==----
I'm not convinced there were two colors. The top picture looks the same at the bow and the second is really close. The slope will lighten the color due to reflectivity.
*edit* forgot to add that I noticed that the Imperial Russian Navy set was back in set yesterday and ordered one... should be here in about a week. I'll try and spray color swatches for evaluation as well as paint review, etc.
I was thinking the same Tracy, first two pics look like reflections/different slopes issue. However, bottom pic show distinct two tones. Could it be AKAN 73103 for the armored belt, and 73102 for the upper hull? Some sources suggest using 73103 for the complete upper hull, everything above the anti-fouling lower hull paint, however it looks too dark to me, almost as a "soot" color of the Russian Baltic squadron (Borodinos et all).
Looking forward to your test of the Russian color set!
----== The eternal mistake of mankind is to set an attainable ideal ==----
The reflectivity seems to be working in the opposite direction... it�s the change in angle of refelected light that brings the two tones closer together...
The bottom picture shows the two in non-direct light which is why they look more clearly differentiated.
I�m sure others will chime in with more than an opinion though... there are a couple of people with extensive knowledge of this era who will come across this thread at some point and give more definitive answers.
Some useful stuff being added here but we are way off topic, as Bill says others will come across this discussion at some point but would it be sensible for me to re-title it something more generic for Tsesarevich research and build to enable wider input? Happy to take guidance from more experienced members.
There is a Calling all Russian Pre-Dreadnought Fans! thread we could have this merged with or potentially turn this into a Tsesarevich-centered CASF as the models are going to drive specific interest.
Well still a n00b here, so not that my voice counts as much, but I'm all for merging this with CASF Russian Pre-Dreadnoughts. That topic is quite empty as it is, and I think there are a number of us fans of those ugly-majestic ships.
There is CASF topic for Tsushima Borodinos which is quite busy (or was, some time ago), and as much as I trawled through some 49 pages of it, I saw the mention of Tsesarevich and other Russian pre-dreads.
----== The eternal mistake of mankind is to set an attainable ideal ==----
Lord_Calidor wrote:I'm all for merging this with CASF Russian Pre-Dreadnoughts.
Done!
Martin
"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." John Wayne
It seems that free plans for Tsesarevich, Poltava and other Russian pre-dreadnoughts on Navarin.ru site (here: http://www.navarin.ru/page_info.php/pages_id/1 ), are no longer available. Anybody knows where we can get them, or somebody has them and is willing to share? If it's legal, of course...
----== The eternal mistake of mankind is to set an attainable ideal ==----
i have the plans of tsessarevich, sissoi veliki, navarin, sevastopol and also
drawings, plans and foto pratically of all
the russian predreadnought.send a pm with your email and the plans you want
ciao peppe
Thanks mate, PM sent.
I'm still trying to decide about color scheme for my upcoming Tsesarevich, battle of the Yellow Sea version. So many conflicting reports and pictures, my head's spinning like a prop axle.
----== The eternal mistake of mankind is to set an attainable ideal ==----
Here's the color scheme of the battleship Pobeda, she was a part of Pacific squadron based at Port Arthur, the same as Tsesarevich, suggested by the Russian book Morskaja Kollekcija 01/1998, that was published as an addition to the Modelist-Konstruktor magazine. It shows often mentioned olive-green/drab hull, with khaki superstructure. Could this be viable option for Tsesarevich, too? Or was it used only for the ships left in Port Arthur at the late 1904, when Tses. was already interned at Tsingtao, and thus had different, earlier scheme?
Attachments
----== The eternal mistake of mankind is to set an attainable ideal ==----
Lord_Calidor wrote:It seems that free plans for Tsesarevich, Poltava and other Russian pre-dreadnoughts on Navarin.ru site (here: http://www.navarin.ru/page_info.php/pages_id/1 ), are no longer available. Anybody knows where we can get them, or somebody has them and is willing to share? If it's legal, of course...
I have the Zvezda Borodino in the stash and have been eyeballing it lately as candidate for my next build; Wrapping up two aircraft and two armor builds and feeling in a maritime mood.
While I like the black paint scheme, I'm hoping that a more colorful "as-built" scheme might exist. But... I'm not finding any references or materials to support this. As she was completed after the start of the war, I'm guessing they painted her in wartime colors and rushed her to the Pacific. Just thought I'd see what the forum member's thoughts are on the existence of something other than the common Russo-Japanese war scheme?
Could Slava be kitbashed from the Zvezda 1/350 Borodino? I have the Borodino, but I'd rather build it as her sister Slava which fought in WW1, so that eventually I can collect all the Tsar's battleships of the Great War in 1/350 (Tsesarevich 1917, Ganguts etc). She met her match at the Battle of Moon Sound in the Gulf of Riga where she was outgunned by SMS Kronprinz and SMS Konig.
I don't really have much sources to go on, since most of the material is about the Russo-Japanese War, which Slava never participated. I'm sure she must have received some upgrades and modifications before the outbreak of WW1, that would differ her from the Borodino. I wouldn't know what, if any, of the photoetch detail set for Borodino would apply to 1917 Slava. If the conversion project would involve too much scratchbuilding and hull/superstructure shaping then I don't think I'll go ahead with it.
I guess it could. It comes down to redesigning the masts, removing aft superstructure and compass platform, increasing the main guns maximum elevation through larger (eg. deeper) gun cutouts, plating over the casemates and instaling elevated rangefinder platform between the funnels.
Concerning armament - by 1917. she had all of her casemated guns removed and plated over, had 6 AA 76mm guns and as far as I can see, 2 light machine guns on the walkway wings abaft of funnel.
I was told Knyaz Suvorov mostly resembled Slava from all the other Borodinos. Not sure about the kit differences, supposedly they are all the same.
Attachments
----== The eternal mistake of mankind is to set an attainable ideal ==----
The modifications would be quite extensive, but Combrig actually does a waterline hull-only of Slava in 1/350. As it's resin, to order the hull and shipping would cost about 3-4x as much as I paid for Zvezda 1/350 Borodino alone I'll just make it as Borodino 1904 for now...
A question for Alexey, recently got the Kagero book on Marat, and the authors renderings of the ship is supposed to be from the World War II period. The cross deck straps that were on this class of ships earlier is absent. Was this the case or was it just an omission by the authors. Thanks Dan
I am building Combrig's 1/350 scale model of this curious ship, but I have come across a conundrum when it comes to the secondary armament. The kit portrays the ship without its original eight 6-in. 30 cal. guns (there are only apparently plated over casemates), although a single such gun with a splinter shield is located on the fantail. When did the Nikolai I lose its other 6-in. guns? Wikipedia is no help in this matter, although it does provide an otherwise reasonably full history.
)
