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PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2019 12:43 pm 
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Thanks. That’s what I thought. Too bad the reflector and PE detail behind the lens will go to waste.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 9:23 pm 
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Here is the Flag Intelligence office on the NJ were the plans are being sorted by type. The amount of chaos decreases over time.

The box on its side is all Bureau of Ships plans for mechanical systems. The box in the middle of the bookshelf is all plans for 16-inch ammunition storage. The stacks on top of the bookcase are plans for the 16-inch turrets. The plans in the bookcase at the right are for boats and boat handling and 5-inch guns and turrets.

In spite of the volume here, nearly all of the structural plans that would be of interest to modelers are not here. None of the mold loft plans have turned up. Dittos for the framing and plating.

Our recent FOIA request to the Navy has turned up nothing. Plans for all battleships were stored in Memphis TN but that facility was closed and it is not known where they went. There were 300 boxes of plans at the Philadelphia shipyard. Some were transferred to the NJ but they total about 90 boxes.

So far no original plans have turned up. Only a few plans made their way to NARA.

History lost?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 3:05 am 
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Perhaps next time when one of the 4 Iowa’s enter dry dock an effort can be made to comprehensively document her plating arrangement photographically?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 03, 2019 6:50 am 
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In 2009, Smart GeoMetrics did a 3D scan project of Missouri when it was being refurbished as a museum ship in Pearl Harbor's drydock:

https://www.pobonline.com/articles/9533 ... -mighty-mo

The effort required dozens of individual scans which captured billions of data points. Unfortunately for us, the information gained has not been released to the public.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 11:23 pm 
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Here's a sight that will never make it to the tour. The powder handing is on the 2d platform. within the turret support there is a ring where crew stand to pass power from the magazines and into the power handing room.

The ring goes all the way around on turrets 2 and 3. On turret 1, the base of the turret support angles in on either side because of the narrowing of the hull.

This is where that angling blocks off the ring. The turret support is at the left and the circular bulkhead around the power handling area is to the right.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2019 11:26 pm 
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chuck wrote:
Perhaps next time when one of the 4 Iowa’s enter dry dock an effort can be made to comprehensively document her plating arrangement photographically?


The documentation on that so far is ufilm that was photographed by someone high on crack at the time.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:57 am 
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That's awesome, Jim. Thanks for sharing what you are discovering with us. Truly remarkable.

It wouldn't be surprising if you found Jimmy Hoffa's body or boxes of Florida ballots during your explorations.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2019 1:29 pm 
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Is the angled bulkhead the inner holding bulkhead of the torpedo defense system?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:31 pm 
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Fliger747 wrote:
Is the angled bulkhead the inner holding bulkhead of the torpedo defense system?


No, it is supporting the turret. This is the area of the picture (I have to take out a lot to show this):

Attachment:
Screen Shot 2019-06-10 at 4.26.31 PM.jpg
Screen Shot 2019-06-10 at 4.26.31 PM.jpg [ 227.28 KiB | Viewed 1973 times ]


The green is the torpedo bulkheads and the gray is the turret support and inner ring. The circular bulkhead shown with the door forward is to the right in the photograh and the sloping gray bulkhead is to the left.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 4:51 pm 
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Thanks! Good illustration!


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 Post subject: Where did the plans go?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:41 pm 
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One of the great mysteries is where did the plans to the Iowa class go?

They never made it to NARA. Nara has one copy blueprint (of the conning tower).

The ships have incomplete sets of copies. The NJ appears to have the largest selection. I have never seen an original.

I learned through FOIA that the plans for BB-36 through BB-66 were sent to the Naval Historical Warehouse in Memphis TN and they were there after 2000. That facility has since closed. Where did they go?

There were 300 boxes of plans at the Philadephia Navy Yard. Some of those made it to the NJ but there are only around about 100 boxes there. Where did 200+ boxes go?

If anyone knows where to go to pick up the trail, I'd appreciate it.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:16 pm 
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Maybe they were left in Hillary's care?


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:37 pm 
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Fliger747 wrote:
Maybe they were left in Hillary's care?


Could explain what happened.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 1:26 pm 
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Hello all. I have a question.
I got a Missouri 1/200 model from Trumpeter together with a Pontos set, I have a question about this model, someone who can buy brass anchors, an anchor chain and portholes for this model?

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 1:50 pm 
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wojtekp90 wrote:
Hello all. I have a question.
I got a Missouri 1/200 model from Trumpeter together with a Pontos set, I have a question about this model, someone who can buy brass anchors, an anchor chain and portholes for this model?


Anchors: I don't think those are available separately.

Anchor Chains: aren't they already included in the Trumpeter kit?

Portholes: sheets 14 and 15 in the Pontos set appear to have some, but I don't know if they are enough for all of the portholes. Maybe save them for fixing the diagonal surfaces where the molded plastic portholes are oval in shape.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:23 pm 
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Go look at Hank Strub's thread on building his 60's New Jersey from this kit. 3D printed chains are available I believe from Floating Drydock and others, as well as anchors, though not in brass. Model Monkey has many parts available in 1:200.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 4:34 pm 
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Wojtekp90 wrote:
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I got a Missouri 1/200 model from Trumpeter together with a Pontos set, I have a question about this model, someone who can buy brass anchors, an anchor chain and portholes for this model?


I don't know why you would want brass anchors - they would be painted haze gray and not left brass, so why spend the money? You can order the 1/200 anchors from Model Monkey, but they will be gray 3D printed plastic also. The kit anchor chain is incorrect and needs replacing. I don't know if Floating Drydock is still selling the correct and scaled 3D printed chains for this kit.

My build of 1:200 USS NEW JERSEY is in the Completed Models sub forum under Picture Post forum.

Hope this helps.

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USS PENNSYLVANIA (BB-38) Late '40 1:200
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USS NEW JERSEY (BB-62) 67-69 1:200
USN Sloop/Ship PEACOCK (1813) 1:48
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 4:41 am 
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Thank you for all the advice, or you advise to use anchors what are included in the set?
I also found these portholes from Pontos.
The chain is incorrect, I noticed it too, so I am going to replace it.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:08 am 
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Where can I find information about Missouri rigging, can you recommend any sources?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 9:47 am 
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The main problem with trumpeter’s jewelry type chain that they offer as metal anchor chain is anchor chain on large ships always are of the studded type. Jewelry chains are not of the studded type. So they just look wrong on a fairly large scale model. Last I checked (about 10 month ago) Floating dry dock no longer sell the studded chain in the correct size.

I believe there are several 3D printed studded chain options available on shapeways.com. Th question is do you want the chains to be flexible or are you okay with the anchor chain being printed as one rigid length with integral pelican hook stoppers. The best flexible chain i’ve Found on Shapeways is somewhat overscale for 1/200 missouri. The rigid length chain is correct scale.

I personally elected to use slightly overscale flexible chain. The overscale is not too severe and can go largely unnoticed on a finished model. The reason i chose flexible chain is trumpeter really didn’t get the geometry of the anchor hawse hole right. So the anchor doesn’t exactly seat correctly in the stowed position. So the rigid chain doesn’t exactly fit correctly.

Trumpeter offers a metal upgrade set (06631) for the Missouri which includes a set of metal anchor flukes. These are essentially identical in shape to the plastic parts that came with the kit. You also only get the flukes, you will still need to use the plastic shanks from the original model to complete the anchor. Neither the plastic nor the metal anchor flukes were totally accurate, but both are reasonable accurate and look the part. So if you want metal anchors, trumpeter has them.

There is also a metal option for studded anchor chain available form Maritime models in the UK. at 10 links per inch it is also slightly over scale. It does not look quite as accurate as 3D printed version because each link is made from wire that’s a bit too thin to replicate the beefy look of real anchor chain links. But metal chain is certainly far more durable than 3D printed chains, which is actually quite brittle. If you want metal chain to go with metal anchors, there you go.

The plans book for the Missouri from floating drydock has all the information about missouri’s Rigging and everything external on that ship in August 1945. The problem is they are not all on one page, you need to go through numerous pages to assemble and digest the information. The book “battleship USS missouri(superdrawing in 3D)’ by Stefan Draminski contains exquisite 3D renders that are not totally reliable in accuracy, but more than good enough to give you a good 3D idea of how rigging go together. So you can use it in conjunction to the very accurate but hard to use and hard to visualize 2D drawings in the floating dry dock plans book.

If you can wait, the upcoming Anatomy of the ship series title on USS Iowa may become an imoortant graphical reference on Iowa class battleships. But that book is currently schedule for release by Osprey on Jan 1 2020. However, it was schedule for release last year and has been repeatedly delayed.

There is also the The Battleships of the Iowa Class: A Design and Operational History by Phillipe Caresse. I’ve heard it is the ultimate printed reference in the Iowa class ships. However, it is currently only available in French. An English translation is scheduled for release by the Naval Instititute Press in oct 2019, but it will be expensive at $120.

As a note, Trumpeter’s model may look impressively like the Missouri, but it is a very mixed bag in terms of detailed accuracy. Aftermarket superdetail sets corrects some inaccuracies, but mostly roll with the punches and just adapt themselves to fit trumpeter’s inaccurate plastic parts. If you like, I can send you a list of problems with the plastic parts that I corrected, and those which I noted but didn’t correct because I still wanted to use the parts from the superdetail sets and it is too much trouble to try to correct the superdetailed PE parts.

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