Calling all Iowa-class (BB-61) fans

[Fliger747]

It's what you wrap the miscreant in (As Whole) in before piping him overboard while underway.

[Rick E Davis]

Since there seems to be a lot of question and interest in USN Catapults lately, there is a good summary by Dr Friedman in his Aircraft Carrier Design History book. Surprisingly, he covers catapults for not only Aircraft Carriers (there was some overlap), but gives a summary of the catapults installed aboard the battleships and cruisers. Not a lot of technical data on the battleship-cruiser catapults, but there is a listing of the "Type A" - Compressed Air and "Type P" Gun Powder catapults and at least general idea of which units had specific catapults installed and when. It is kind of interesting that the "Type P Mk VI", the type used on most USN battleships (along with "Type P Mk IV" installed atop battleship turrets) and cruisers, started testing in 1929, while the Type A Mk IV was first installed in 1931 onboard USS RICHMOND. The writeup is in Annex B, pg 177.

[Fliger747]

Thank you R.E.D.!

I do have that book though it's not one I reference very often. I'll check that out!

Regards: Tom

[bigjimslade]

what are "sheet casings"?

Shell

The type P catapult was designed by the Bureau of Ordinance. A 5-inch blank cartridge was fired into an expansion chamber that drove a piston.

The advantage of the type P was that it was entirely self-contained. It could be mounted on top of a turret without having drill holes through the turret for power or hydraulics.

[Fliger747]

The 5" 38 was a semi fixed shell and casing combo. The shell and casings were separate items, so my understanding was that a standard 5" 38 casing, without the shell could be used (not really a blank). When firing the 5" mounts, a noticeable burnt cork smell was noticeable as a large cork was used to plug the mouth of the cartridge. What I don't know was as the cartridge was used to generate gas pressure to activate the catapult, there would have had to have been some system to evacuate a potential cork debris buildup. A diagram showing the workings of this system would be informative.

A simple and effective system. By contrast Bismarck used a compressed air system. Some minor damage caused by one of POW's hits caused their system to become inoperable when an attempt was made to fly the Kriegstagbuch (war diary) to safety. Perhaps a subject of some disappointment to the pilot.

[Ian Roberts]

Since there seems to be a lot of question and interest in USN Catapults lately, there is a good summary by Dr Friedman in his Aircraft Carrier Design History book. Surprisingly, he covers catapults for not only Aircraft Carriers (there was some overlap), but gives a summary of the catapults installed aboard the battleships and cruisers. Not a lot of technical data on the battleship-cruiser catapults, but there is a listing of the "Type A" - Compressed Air and "Type P" Gun Powder catapults and at least general idea of which units had specific catapults installed and when. It is kind of interesting that the "Type P Mk VI", the type used on most USN battleships (along with "Type P Mk IV" installed atop battleship turrets) and cruisers, started testing in 1929, while the Type A Mk IV was first installed in 1931 onboard USS RICHMOND. The writeup is in Annex B, pg 177.

Thx Rick - I hadn't seen this appendix yet but very useful info!

Here are the pages, reproduced here under a "fair use" context:

[BB63Missouri]

There is good information on the Type P Catapult and its operation on the NavSource online archive, "Instructions for Operation of Catapult Type P"

David

[Fliger747]

Perhaps you could post a link? Gong to Navsource not doing search are revealing anything fo me currently. There has been Whitehouse motions about banning old folks from using computers?

[maccrage]

Here you go.
http://www.navsource.org/archives/01/57l.htm

[Fliger747]

Thank you very much!

[bigjimslade]

I'll share here.....

The original blueprints for BB-34-BB-66 were sent to the Naval Historical Warehouse in Memphis TN. That warehouse was closed and all evidence is that the contents were destroyed.

A full set of plans was sent to the Philadelphia Naval Yard (300 boxes). All of the spare parts for the Iowa class were moved to the U.S.S. Charleston and it appears the blueprints went as well.

The U.S.S. Charleston is slated to be scrapped, taking all the spare parts and blueprints to the furnace.

[Fliger747]

Make it easier to re write the "history" when the archives go away.

[BB62vet]

BigJimSlade wrote:

The U.S.S. Charleston is slated to be scrapped, taking all the spare parts and blueprints to the furnace.

Jim - isn't the USS CHARLESTON (LCS-18) a rather new ship to be scrapped? She just entered the fleet in 2019. Perhaps you mean another ship.

Or....do you mean USS CHARLESTON (LKA-113) which decommissioned in 1992? Please give details.

If so, I wonder if it would be possible to write someone in the Navy Dept. and see if those plans could be salvaged, etc.

Thanks,

Hank

[bigjimslade]

It's LKA-113. She's sitting in Philly waiting for the breakers.

BigJimSlade wrote:

The U.S.S. Charleston is slated to be scrapped, taking all the spare parts and blueprints to the furnace.

Jim - isn't the USS CHARLESTON (LCS-18) a rather new ship to be scrapped? She just entered the fleet in 2019. Perhaps you mean another ship.

Or....do you mean USS CHARLESTON (LKA-113) which decommissioned in 1992? Please give details.

Response from my senator on this:

Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts with me. I appreciate hearing from you and rely on the input of engaged New Jerseyans when making decisions.

I am inspired by the dedication and activism of constituents across the state of New Jersey who take the time to contact me on issues of concern or to share stories about how legislation in Washington, DC affects their daily lives. Thank you for being one of those voices. I want to let you know that my office has received your message.

I am honored to represent you in the United States Senate, and I hope you will continue to contact me and my staff about the issues that are important to you. There are many challenges before us, but I know that if we work together we will be able to make our state and our nation stronger.

For more information on my work in New Jersey and Washington, DC, please visit my website at booker.senate.gov. If you would like to speak with my staff about a policy issue, please call (202)-224-3224.

You can tell he is really paying attention to the voters.

[BB62vet]

Jim,

I did Google Map the Philadelphia Navy Yard and saw where CHARLESTON is tied up. So, are they planning to sink her in a SINKEX exercise or simply sell her for scrap?

Hank

[bigjimslade]

Jim,

I did Google Map the Philadelphia Navy Yard and saw where CHARLESTON is tied up. So, are they planning to sink her in a SINKEX exercise or simply sell her for scrap?

My understanding is that the means of execution has not yet been decided.

[bigjimslade]

I am trying to do some illustrations where I face the problem of understandability trading off against precision. The more precise I get, the more cluttered things become, and the less understandable things are.

I ask the folks here, would you consider this sufficient detail to gain an understanding of the layout of a fire room? If not, what more would you like to see?

Normally, I would use a deck plan to describe ship layout but there are thirteen levels in the fire room and I find that a 2D representation is just too confusing.

[Fliger747]

Jim:

Those remind me of the photos of the ship under construction! Some additional detail would help flesh out the apparent functionality of the components. I wonder if the layout of Sacramento's Fire room changed from the Iowa (Kentucky?) from which it was robbed. I presume that is a shaft on the left of the photo underneath the boilers?

Regards: Tom

[bigjimslade]

Those remind me of the photos of the ship under construction! Some additional detail would help flesh out the apparent functionality of the components. I wonder if the layout of Sacramento's Fire room changed from the Iowa (Kentucky?) from which it was robbed. I presume that is a shaft on the left of the photo underneath the boilers?

Yes, the one shaft is at the port side. The lower level has a lot of pumps. that would then need pipes to make sense. Then there would be pipes all over.

I should add, that there will be photographs to go with this. These models are primarily to show where the photographs were taken.

[BB62vet]

Jim,

Your 3D model photos remind me of the engineering section models that were made for USS NORTH CAROLINA (BB-55) - they are displayed with the 1/96 model of the ship and are section cuts of the ship's hull showing all the various decks and machinery. Each one is mounted with a Plexiglas cover to keep "little hands" from messing with things. It's been quite a few years since I was aboard BB-55, so I'm under the impression that those are still on display.

Your 3D model is very nicely done - if there are any pumps, motors, etc. that you've left out - go ahead and add them - usually with pumps there is a flange that belongs to the pump on all inlet/outlet piping, so you could show the pump w/flanges and let it go at that (i.e. no piping). Just a suggestion!

Hank