Calling all Royal Navy Ships' Boats of WWII fans

[81542]

EJF,

I have of copy of the Warship Profile No 19. It contains a copy of your main image on page 152, stating that it was Admiral Somerville's barge: the date is July '40. There is another image on page 160 showing the "Admiral's barge" which is a different type. On page 166 there is then another image of the boat deck (you are probably already aware of this one): it shows the boat on page 160, uncovered. Further aft is what is possibly a high chine boat that is covered and is possibly the boat behind the sailor in the bottom left corner of your main image. It is difficult to determine even the vaguest idea as to the shape of its superstructure.

Looking critically at the boat in the bottom left corner seems to indicate that it is of the same type in the main picture though the wheelhouse of the boat in the latter cannot be made out clearly. However, the wheelhouse of the former is indicative of the boat being of British Power Boat Company (BPBC) manufacture. Additionally, the reverse forward sheer of fore deck of the boat in the bottom left corner is, to my mind an indicative feature of a BPBC design (see the lower two attachments).

The boat may well have been unique. Obtaining precise details from the NMM might be possible but will require a trawl through the BPBC collection; which even then might prove fruitless. Given that one now has a narrower " field" to look at though it might be worth asking the NMM to do a search.

I'm sorry that I can't be of more help on this one.

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[81542]

EJF,

Re: Latest revision of blog.

1. The pulling boat in the top image is a 32ft pulling and sailing Cutter rigged as a seaboat; which judging from the shape of the boat's badge, appears to belong to a cruiser. The boat is being steered by what appears to be a midshipman being mentored by a 3 badged leading seaman. The co-ordination of the crew appears to be in a bit of a mess!

2. The drawing of the 45ft Fast Motor Picket Boat as found in Lavery's Churchill's Navy is the boat carried in HMS RESOLUTION in mid 1939. The length and type was confirmed from a photograph in the Richard Perkin's collection in the National Maritime Museum. The photograph number is N7500.

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[EJFoeth]

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[81542]

EJF,

Re: Your Paragraph 2 in the above post.

The battlewagon in the attachment is not RESO! Be that as it may, you may not find the photograph that I mentioned (N7500) on the NMM website but it is in the Perkins collection held by Historic Photographs and Ships Plans. I am not aware of any pictures showing the boat onboard HMS RESOLUTION: the one mentioned shows the boat alongside, secured to the starboard guest warp, or lower, boom.
The ship's name can be clearly made out on the "name box" on its superstructure.

I am glad that you found "Stapleton" useful and that though it appears to have been taken out of service by 1939, you included the picture of the 45ft Steam Pinnace/Admiral's barge in the blog. Sadly, Mr Ough does not seem to have made a drawing of it.

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[EJFoeth]

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[81542]

More correctly known as a "yoke type" tiller arrangement. Interesting in that it appears to have been fitted in a "seaboat," when in the late 20th Century it was usually only fitted if the boat was rigged for sailing. Otherwise, the "Stroke" oarsman appears to have
"caught a crab," though the boat does not appear to be under weigh so the crew may be "holding water." The oars have a "square" finish to part of their "looms;" which was not the fashion later on. I would not have liked to try and "pull" an oar with those cork/canvas life preservers the crew are wearing! The "L21" on the practice warhead of the torpedo may identify the weapon as belonging to HM Submarine "L21" but that is a "guess."

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[FrancisMcN]

I am trying to find out more on the boats onboard a Bellona/Mod Dido class cruiser, especially what is shown on the official profile drawing as a "30' motor boat" and kept on the starboard side aft of the 27' whaler. I see such a boat is listed in the 1937 Manual of Seamanship list mentioned earlier in this thread under the fast boats section. Can anyone advise if it is likely to have a similar arrangement and proportions as the 25' and 35' motor boats above and below it in the list or has anyone come across a useful plan by any chance?

[EJFoeth]

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[81542]

Francis,

Try looking in "The Anatomy of the Ship" books dealing with either HMS BELFAST or HMS HOOD, I have a gut feeling (but could be wrong) that there might be a scale plan of one in one of those. Plymouth City Library may have copies or might be able to get them on inter-library loan for a small consideration. The BELFAST book might be the best bet.

Failing that, send an e-mail to the Historic Photographs and Ships Plans at the NMM, attaching a picture as an aid. The Historic Dockyard in Portsmouth might also be a useful avenue.

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[FrancisMcN]

Many thanks for the assistance in the last 2 posts and I now have what I need - I forgot to check my list of John Lambert list of drawings.
I did look in the AotS for Belfast but this has the 35' and 25' boats only.

The 30 foot boat has a fair bit in common with the 25 and 35 ft boats but there are differences too. Now to start making one in 1/200th

[81542]

It will be interesting to see how you achieve that Francis. Doing it in 1:192 for a 45ft boat was. In addition, you also have to replicate the clinkering of the upper hull planking.

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[EJFoeth]

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[EJFoeth]

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[Cag]

Hi All

Hi Evert Jan, many thanks as always for the hard work, much appreciated

Best wishes
Cag.

[NavyShooter]

OK,

I was looking for info on small boats, I came across your "On the Slipway" page, and then get directed back here. Very nicely done!

So, a question - I'm working on a model of the HMCS Bonaventure - is there any good way to figure out which ships boats would have been carried by her?

From what I can tell, there are 4x boats, 2 each port/stbd.

Based on looking at pictures, and comparing with your listing of boats, I'm thinking that one of them (Portside, Fwd) might be the 35 Foot Fast Motor Boat Seaplane Tender:
https://ontheslipway.com/35-ft-fast-mot ... ne-tender/

Length is right-ish, and the central cabin looks about right too.

Many thanks!

NS

[EJFoeth]

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[81542]

Navy Shooter,

Re: Your Post of 13 Dec.

Sorry, I've only just noticed this one. I will try to help.

I appreciate EJF's reply of the same day to you but I suggest that you contact your (Canadian) Ministry of Defence (Navy) office for further, deeper help on this one. I feel sure that they would help you. The boat in the attachment to your post appears similar to that in No 9 image in the last montage of boats in the "Carrierbuilders" link posted by EJF. I see a double ended motor boat with a cabin.
It does not appear to be a boat of British pattern and is therefore probably of Canadian origin. HMCS BONAVENTURE may have had some boats of a British Admiralty pattern but not having any photographs of her I can't give you anymore than that.

Canadian Ministry of Defence (Navy) might be able to advise you of details of the ship's boat establishment at the time period that you are making a model of the ship or failing that advise you of the whereabouts of the information i.e. the place where the drawings of the ship have been archived now that she is no longer in service, that you are looking for, presuming that they have been de-classified.

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[Timmy C]

The Shearwater Aviation Museum is probably the main publicly-accessible interface with Bonaventure's history, so I'd go through them first before trying the maze of molasses that is DND: http://www.shearwateraviationmuseum.ns. ... ontact.htm


Snowie's "The Bonnie" (which you should get) includes a small reproduction of the ships' starboard general arrangement drawings on page 22-24 held in the "National Map Collection, Public Archives of Canada, Item 1257 & 1262." It mentions a "32' motor cutter" for the starboard aft

From your build thread, it seems you have a set of drawings - do they not mention the boats?

[hj1985]

Hi EJF

Thank you for your great work.

One thing I would like to mention is your comment here

i. As the principal power boat in "Penelope" and "Aurora"

https://ontheslipway.com/30-ft-fast-motor-boat-type-i/

I measured the part (GB24-5) in Flyhawk's 1/700 Aurora kit, it is measured approx. 11.1mm (25ft when scaled up by 700), so it is likely to be the 25 ft FMB.

Also I have some questions regarding boats carried by HMS Norfolk in 1943 (which I'm currently working on), I post them here, hoping someone could shed light on it.

Aoshima Instruction

Kit detail

Motor boat 1/700

268456814_10165970614925343_4997979085172479064_n.jpg (6.56 KiB) Viewed 4478 times

Firstly, Aoshima's instruction is wrong, part K4, K5 used in step <a> actually resembles part K3 and K6.
Can I use below to replace part K1? It is measured approx. 13.3mm. Scaled up by 700, it is approx. 31ft, although the kit looks slightly different from 3D part towards the end
https://micromaster.co.nz/.../1-700-roy ... -32ft-life...
2. Can I use below to replace Part K4+K5? it is measured approx. 15.1mm (34.7ft). I'm not sure what K3+K6 is, it is of the same length, so must be a 35ft long boat?
https://micromaster.co.nz/.../1-700-roy ... -35ft-fast...
3. Can I use below to replace part K8 measured at 7mm (16ft)? Again, the kit looks slightly different from 3D part towards the end.
https://micromaster.co.nz/.../1-700-royal-navy-16ft...
4. I think this is a 35ft Motor Launch with Cabin as it measured approx. 15.5mm (36ft). However I only find a 45ft one in Simon's offering.
https://www.shapeways.com/.../1-700-ww2-rn-boat-set-2...
5. I have no idea about K10. It is measured approx. 12mm (27.5ft). I guess it is a 27ft whaler, Aoshima may get the interior structure wrong.