Ukraine vs Russia: Cruiser Moskva sunk

[Iceman 29]

There is a tugboat to starboard it seems, along the hull, we see its masts, its fire guns in service.

[Iceman 29]

��It's Prj. 712 sea rescue tug Shakhter (SB-922).

Note location of fire hoses, levels of the masts &part of the funnel visible behind Moskva.

h/t @Capt_Navy for their pic & @ameliairheart for help!��

https://mobile.twitter.com/vcdgf555/sta ... 7485472771

[pascalemod]

For all the media exposure about the Slava class cruiser Moskva, I am very surprised no one is discussing her sister ship Ukrainia, which had lain incomplete (95%) and untouched at the Ukrainian shipyard of the Mikolayiv for decades and was still untouched as of 2021. (pictured below)

There is even a 1/700 Trumpeter kit of the never-completed ship in Ukrainian Navy service, with the name "Vilna Ukrainia" :

I watched a video about Ukraina few weeks back, it is in non-restorable state anyway. Nothing to discuss really. It is too big a ship for Ukraine navy to keep and maintain. There are no aircraft career groups it needs to attack...

But do you think Trumpeter kits of Moskva and Vilna Ukraina are very similar to convert Moskva to Ukraina or Moskva being very modern in comparison is too advanced to backdate?

[Kometa]

Again the big lies of the Russian authorities, just like what happened with the Kursk.
Ammunition fire. If so, the ship would have blown up completely. You can see in the photographs that it is the same as what happened in the HMS Sheffield and there are at least two impacts.
Storm at sea. Also in the photos you can see gigantic waves of at least an inch.

Just like what happened in the Kursk, lies, lies and lies.

[pascalemod]

Again the big lies of the Russian authorities, just like what happened with the Kursk.
Ammunition fire. If so, the ship would have blown up completely. You can see in the photographs that it is the same as what happened in the HMS Sheffield and there are at least two impacts.
Storm at sea. Also in the photos you can see gigantic waves of at least an inch.

Just like what happened in the Kursk, lies, lies and lies.

I think more pics will come out as there were more ships on the scene. Difficult to keep this out. But they will lie anyway, you are right.

[Iceman 29]

Video: https://twitter.com/AlexKokcharov/statu ... 7401328642

The tugboat.







https://twitter.com/CovertShores/status ... 7867878404

[Guest]

The vessel sinking in the inserted 1.26 minute clip in Iceman 29's post of 2.22pm 17 April (Page 2 of this Thread) is NOT Moskva!

[PHILIPPE]

According to an inquiry of the French second TV channel, there are most certainly heavy casualties in the 500 sailors crew, against the lies of the Kremlin which said everybody had been rescued. Difficult to give figures but Russian TV has only shown 150 of the rescued sailors, and nobody (out of the Kremlin) knows where the others are.

[Alexey Loginov]

Again the big lies of the Russian authorities, just like what happened with the Kursk.
Ammunition fire. If so, the ship would have blown up completely.

Are you an expert on Atlanteans? Which ammunition cellar exploded (type or caliber)?

I think more pics will come out as there were more ships on the scene. Difficult to keep this out. But they will lie anyway, you are right.

True/False/Holy Scripture. No one has to explain anything to you. The Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation is not interested in your opinion.

[Iceman 29]

The vessel sinking in the inserted 1.26 minute clip in Iceman 29's post of 2.22pm 17 April (Page 2 of this Thread) is NOT Moskva!

Everyone has seen that this is the Saratov, a video contextualised in relation to the death of its master.

[Guest]

No, Iceman 29, when I looked at that post at approximately 1500 BST there was a small clip inserted in that showing the destruction of Saratov whilst at an alongside berth: it has since been removed. The clip showed a man o' war sinking by the bows. What I was unfortunately able to write at the time was that it was a clip of the previous Moskva: helicopter cruiser, if memory serves me, or a class-mate of hers. The clip probably showed the demise of the ship after it had been used as a target. The superstructure and bow were all the wrong shape to the shot to have been of the recently lost Moskva ex Slava.

Any further comment?

[Kometa]

Again the big lies of the Russian authorities, just like what happened with the Kursk.
Ammunition fire. If so, the ship would have blown up completely.

Are you an expert on Atlanteans? Which ammunition cellar exploded (type or caliber)?

I am not an expert, but already in the past a fire with ammunition is not a good combination (Maine, Mutsu, Vanguard, Princeton, etc.). There are abundant examples in all eras and a lot of technical documentation on this. The first information from the Russian authorities indicated that reason for the situation of the ship.

[pascalemod]

True/False/Holy Scripture. No one has to explain anything to you. The Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation is not interested in your opinion.

Sorry I dont know if you are being sarcastic or - outright defending russian navy here re Moskva sinking and communication about it.

[Maarten Sch�nfeld]

Apocalyptic Horses.jpg

[bigtodd]

Wow, great info on this. Thanks.

[Alexey Loginov]

I am not an expert, but already in the past a fire with ammunition is not a good combination (Maine, Mutsu, Vanguard, Princeton, etc.).

According to insider information, there was a fire followed by a partial explosion of the cellar of 30-mm ammunition AK-630 (between engine rooms). 30x165mm shell is very resistant to detonation.

Sorry I dont know if you are being sarcastic or - outright defending russian navy here re Moskva sinking and communication about it.

I'm not defending what happened. But the reasons for what happened require investigation. If I didn't want to figure it out, I'd say: But they will lie anyway, you are right. (?)
"They" are still silent, but everything has already been decided for them. Then why do you need the truth at all?
Maybe we won't be in a hurry?

[Kometa]

According to information from the Russian Ministry of Defense, there was detonation of ammunition that caused a fire and that the ship was being towed. The AK-630 system is confined in a structure that preserves the mechanisms and ammunition that has 2,000 bullets. I think this was the version installed on the Movska. The structure should reduce any type of damage caused by the system. It is surprising that it causes such serious damage and that the ship shows other damage in areas far from the most affected area.

800px-Ak630feux.jpg

[mister me]

According to insider information, there was a fire followed by a partial explosion of the cellar of 30-mm ammunition AK-630 (between engine rooms). 30x165mm shell is very resistant to detonation.

then the real question shall be :

is this fire of accidental origin,
or is this fire due to a missile hit...

[pascalemod]

According to insider information, there was a fire followed by a partial explosion of the cellar of 30-mm ammunition AK-630 (between engine rooms). 30x165mm shell is very resistant to detonation.

then the real question shall be :

is this fire of accidental origin,
or is this fire due to a missile hit...

Yes, and then Russians bombed next day the factory making these Neptun missiles just to confirm Ukrainian story and to hide the fact that the ship blew up because of some sabotage. Ok, this is some next level.

I am reading these fun theories, but I also have eyes and looks like ship was hit by missile, looks like they evacuated most people, looks like there was no storm when pic was taken and looks like it sunk because damage was too big.

Of course, nothing is certain but having some common sense is useful also. That's the thing in internet age - everyone is like "no no, this is not so certain I wait for explanation". Ok , you will probably get them, but if you dont like them you wont accept them anyway. Same with Kursk - people who believe it was hit by NATO boat will believe it till cows go home, while common sense says otherwise. Same people usually had been on the fence with vaccines, flat earth, qanon, etc. Not all, but venn diagram overlap is pretty decent.

[Alexey Loginov]

It would be better if it was a rocket.