The Ship Model Forum

Hi to All,

I had this old kit with this awful box art by some years without idea how to start it.



Recently researching somethings in this forum, I found this excelent work by Ramaja, here. And comparing it with some references I have, I concluded it is the start point I needed to begun my work at my Pola. Because he synthesized the kit main faults in his work.

Mini Hobby's Pola is just an old encarnation from the same kit now comercialized under HobbyBoss label, with the same faults and mistakes.

Other references I'm using are:

- Warship Pictorial 23 - Italian Heavy Cruisers Of WW2
- Biblioteka Magazynu Morze Statik i Okrety 14 - Italian Heavy Cruisers
- Orizzonte Mare A4 - Incorciatori Pesanti Classe Zara
- Profile Morskie 017 - Zara

- Some pictures references from Cinecitt� Luce

http://camera.archivioluce.com/camera-s ... la&x=0&y=0

- Some pictures references from Archivio Centrale dello Stato
http://dati.acs.beniculturali.it/SecondaGuerraMondiale/

- Some Youtube links from Luce Films for References

For Pola itself

. Livorno SM il Re ed i Reali Principi assistono al varo della RN Pola
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHY4-p6jiAk

. La consegna della Bandiera di Combattimento all'incrociatore Pola
http://youtu.be/Uq2-1Lzg3WI

. Le grandi manovre navali nel Golfo di Gaeta
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8w6ELIQLOA

. L'Italia sul mare fase conclusiva delle esercitazioni a Gaeta
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISZr1vEPFvM

. 1938 Le Manovre Navali di Napoli
Part 1 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENo8I6LiMHs
Part 2 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HT5SnvBayxM

For other Zara Class Cruisers

. A Livorno il varo dell'incrociatore 'Gorizia'
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmrh-sBr3Uw

. La consegna della bandiera di Combattimento all'incrociatore Gorizia
http://youtu.be/4XMo40YXGUY

. A Trieste il varo dell'incrociatore Fiume e la messa in cantiere del Superconte
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ND_a7RkIDRE

. Varo incrociatore Zara
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4pePoxJXD4

. La consegna della bandiera all'incrociatore Zara
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKCV088gh0k

I started my work correcting the bow shape, because for me it's the worst fault in this kit.

Bow before:



The bow after:



Continuing in the same line, I adjusted the stern curvature too.

Stern before:



And the stern after:



For bow and stern corrections I needed to reinforce inner parts with some kind of epoxy putty because plastic surfaces was near to be ruptured in sanding process.

As Ramaja, I observed too some mistakes in main turrets positions, and I think too some details moulded on decks are awful. For me too the best solution was to do new decks with plasticard, positioning better each barbette and recreating deck details.

Starting the new front deck:



With front barbette installed and metall plates represented:



The lower deck received metal plates too until the point the wood deck is beginning.



I eliminated the two external platforms too because they was wrong positioned and with a wrong shape. Seems to me only Fiume had these round platforms, at Pola they had trapezium form.



Some plastcard reinforcements to support new decks.



Observing these gallerys under central deck, I conclude the kit represented it until too far from the point its ending, creating an empty aspect under front deck. I extended it until it's ending was not soo much visible, as I saw in some Zara class ships pictures.



Another correction here was, I removed supports from the last two 37/54mm AA platforms under central decks and glued it under the two secoundary frontal guns. These largers supports was useds only under 100mm AA turrets from the original Pola configuration. The two last Breda's 37/54mm platforms was added latter and has a narrower supports than 100mm turrets. In another hand, frontal 100m turrets supports are missing in this kit.





I take advantage from gallery prolongations to create supports for frontal deck.

Central deck with metal plates and AA platforms corrected, seems to me when Banner resized Tauro's Pola for 1/350, they copied the same wrong AA platforms shape from Tauro's kit.



Frontal superstructure from this kit has soo much issues, may be it's the worst kit part. Some spurious raised surfaces needs to be sanded and bridge has a wrong shape. I repositioned some windows and portholes to do a closest appearence with reference pictures. I chose to create glass window and portholes with clear plastic and clear sprues because seems they was too large in this ship and without glass they had a strange appearence.







Some decks had spurious details and wrong shape, for these reasons I prefered to substitute them for new ones. A strange fault in this kit is the four masts missing on bridge, I dont understand why Banner don't copied them too from Tauro's kit.



Here a dry fitting to be sure all parts are fitting well.



A new frontal range finder started and new platforms for the two Obice Illuminante da 120/15 guns added to represent a 1940/41 configuration.



Some details to be added on this struture:



And another dry fitting:



(continues soon...)

Best Regards,

Ricardo

Very good work!

Another great project from that junk kit I like your style, it's clean and sharp!

I like the way you keep your work clean! My Pola looks a mess!

Ramaja wrote:I like the way you keep your work clean! My Pola looks a mess!

Please, dont be shamed for it . It's only because I'm soo much systematic in all things I do.

Hi,

Some advances in project this week:

- A new pair of anti-roll wings was done, but it be will only placed on hull later to avoid damages.



- Platforms was replaced at rear funnel, they was repositioned a little bit distant from original position for to be more coerent with photos.







- This strange plastic sandwich at top picture was the begun of the new front funnel cap. It was, perhaps, the most stupid way to do a new funnel cap, but it was the only idea I had in mind to do it.




- And it's the resultant piece.





-These AA directors has very strange format in kit, I begun to do them starting from kit original piece's parts. But unfortunately I don't have good drawings from them and I'll wait to interpretate better pictures I have before add other details.

- Initially I was interpreting this top cabin with this configuration:



- But after seeing this Zara's superstructure picture I changed my mind about it. Comparing this picture with some pictures from Zara class cruisers from the Life Magazine's pictures sequence. I concluded, Pola probably had the same top cabin configuration used on Zara.



- And the new top cabin.



- Fitting some parts at this superstructure is very critical, I added some devices on pieces to facilitate the future assembly.





- And a dry fitting with the new pieces on it's places:

I have seen people posting about incorrect bow and stern on models posting lots of pictures with lots of fancy lines, then not bother with the kit. Its great to actually see someone talk about an incorrect bow and stern and then show us their corrections.

All I can say is fantastic work, I will be following this to see how she turns out

Before it's too late to do something: the AA fire directors are still off; in fact, the kit's part may well be trashed at once. The real thing was a cylinder with a conical roof and a box on the back for the rangefinder.

Secondo wrote:Before it's too late to do something: the AA fire directors are still off; in fact, the kit's part may well be trashed at once. The real thing was a cylinder with a conical roof and a box on the back for the rangefinder.

Hi Secondo,

I agree with you, AA fire directors from kit are terrible. But unfortunatelly the model you showed in this drawing was used only on Zara.



Pola used another model with a very different shape:





Best Regards,

Ricardo

My bad, I should have checked my references more attentively Sorry for the misleading!

Digging into the matter, I found that this kind of director was used on Zara and Fiume; Pola and Gorizia had the "sloped" type with an opening on the top.

Edit: a good profile of Pola can be found here:

http://www.naviearmatori.net/albums/use ... 200%29.jpg

Secondo wrote:My bad, I should have checked my references more attentively Sorry for the misleading!

Digging into the matter, I found that this kind of director was used on Zara and Fiume; Pola and Gorizia had the "sloped" type with an opening on the top.

Edit: a good profile of Pola can be found here:

http://www.naviearmatori.net/albums/use ... 200%29.jpg

Ok, you're correct, model used in Gorizia looks much more like the used in Pola and I can use some pictures from it as reference.

I agree this profile is very good, but I see some inconsistences in it's AA fire directors format when comparing it with pictures.

For me the better Pola profile I know was this one published at Warship Pictorial 23 and replicated at Hobby Boss Pola edition. But unfortunatelly it don't show a lateral profile from these AA directors.

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/image/10087075t2/60/2

Best Regards,

Ricardo

Hi R.Ricardo, very clean job as always.
The range-finders look good but the inclined plate on top is probably too straight. IMO, looking at the sparse pics I found here and there and there seems to be may be a slight curve, some kind of concavity, or at least a more vertically inclined flat surface with a dent somehow smaller then the inclined plate probably housing observers with binoculars. I can't tell exactly, I'm sorry.
The new configuration of the upper tower, just below the main range-finder does not entirely convince me... Looking at the pics of the Pola, (chek some on my project and some on this same tread, seems to indicate two things: first of all it was a later addiction, not present before 1937, On those pics which show the structure, the main tripod seems visible anyway, meaning it was not completely inside the structure itself. If you check on early pics there is an horizonatal welded plate jut before the two rods of the main tree join, which could have been used as a rail to close the metal wall. IMO the walls of the cabin were just metal panels welded between the tree structure, and not a whole box containing the tripod itself...
Check your references and tell me what you think.

Keep on with the good work

Ramaja wrote:Hi R.Ricardo, very clean job as always.
The range-finders look good but the inclined plate on top is probably too straight. IMO, looking at the sparse pics I found here and there and there seems to be may be a slight curve, some kind of concavity, or at least a more vertically inclined flat surface with a dent somehow smaller then the inclined plate probably housing observers with binoculars. I can't tell exactly, I'm sorry.
The new configuration of the upper tower, just below the main range-finder does not entirely convince me... Looking at the pics of the Pola, (chek some on my project and some on this same tread, seems to indicate two things: first of all it was a later addiction, not present before 1937, On those pics which show the structure, the main tripod seems visible anyway, meaning it was not completely inside the structure itself. If you check on early pics there is an horizonatal welded plate jut before the two rods of the main tree join, which could have been used as a rail to close the metal wall. IMO the walls of the cabin were just metal panels welded between the tree structure, and not a whole box containing the tripod itself...
Check your references and tell me what you think.

Keep on with the good work

Hi Ramaja,

About range-finders, may be you're correct. Like you I suffered with the lack of good plans and I only sketched it's general format until I have more elements for a definitive conclusions about it. I asked you for more pictures from your work at your post, to use them as reference and comparation with my own researchs.


About the upper tower, yes, I agree with you, its a latter addition as you said. But my conclusion about it had involved the four masts was based in what I'm seeing in the pictures below.

- The 1st one is the same from Zara I posted above, that pointed to me the direction I needed to see in the other pictures to have my conclusions.



- The second is a detail from a picture from Life Magazine, that show in sequence Fiume, Zara and Pola. Observe the same door I pointed (1) at picture above is barely visible at Pola upper tower. It seems for me, there was some similarities between Zara and Pola in this tower.



- The third is this picture with Pola behind Gorizia, here we can see this tower from rear. Seems for me this vertical line I pointed is the corner I pointed (2) at Zara's picture.



- Here a detail from drawing published at Warship Pictorial 23 - Italian Heavy Cruisers Of WW2. It's the same drawing now issued with the Hobby-Boss edition from Pola. I checked this drawing with pictures evidences and perhaps it's not perfect, but until now it's the better Pola drawing I found. Observe, it show the same conclusion with this tower involving the four masts.



And finaly a drawing from another source (http://www.naviearmatori.net/albums/use ... 200%29.jpg), showing the same interpretation:



I agree nothing I posted here is totally conclusive, but for me it's a possible interpretation for this tower format. I continue with my mind open to continues this discussion with some new evidences.

Best Regards,

Ricardo

I'll try posting better pics from my range finders tomorrow, but I'm not that much convinced of them as well.
About the drawings from warship pictorial, it depends on what you are trying to reproduce: this drawing still shows 40mm Vikers Pon Pon and the Pola was changed again just before the war.
The forward part of the structure you did (with the forward windows) is correct IMO, but I have doubts about the rear new part you added: the pic in colour you showed with the four aligned ship is From the Rivista H in 1938, just before the mayor re-haul of the ship (it is missing the whole rear structure we are discussing. As far as I can tell, there was a narrow observation front platform which was protected with windows after some time, but was not extending rearward at the beginning. then the rear cabin was created and it was inserted between the quadripod rods.
The rear view of the ship in the pic below. shows the peculiar extension of the cabin on the large platform which embraces the forward funnel, not much different form what you did in the first version of your superstructure.
The reason I'm so interested is that I'm not really sure of how to do that and may be I'll change my own again
I'll try to check my references tomorrow to better focus the problem, but I'd not trust the Warship pictorial plan: it is a mix between 1934 and 1939 Pola with a lot of speculations in between.

Ramaja wrote:I'll try posting better pics from my range finders tomorrow, but I'm not that much convinced of them as well.
About the drawings from warship pictorial, it depends on what you are trying to reproduce: this drawing still shows 40mm Vikers Pon Pon and the Pola was changed again just before the war.
The forward part of the structure you did (with the forward windows) is correct IMO, but I have doubts about the rear new part you added: the pic in colour you showed with the four aligned ship is From the Rivista H in 1938, just before the mayor re-haul of the ship (it is missing the whole rear structure we are discussing. As far as I can tell, there was a narrow observation front platform which was protected with windows after some time, but was not extending rearward at the beginning. then the rear cabin was created and it was inserted between the quadripod rods.
The rear view of the ship in the pic below. shows the peculiar extension of the cabin on the large platform which embraces the forward funnel, not much different form what you did in the first version of your superstructure.
The reason I'm so interested is that I'm not really sure of how to do that and may be I'll change my own again
I'll try to check my references tomorrow to better focus the problem, but I'd not trust the Warship pictorial plan: it is a mix between 1934 and 1939 Pola with a lot of speculations in between.

OK Ramaja,

Post your range finders pictures and we can discuss it's format, perhaps together we take a good conclusion about it. May be drawings from Pola was influenced by Zara's configuration like me. But without a good evidence in other way, I think it's a possible interpretation for this tower. I'll wait what you find in your references too before a definitive conclusion. For me is easy to change something, if it will be needed, because nothing is glued on it's place.

Here some pictures from Zara's rear tower for comparations.







And a detail from a snapshot from Pola at a 1938 parade Luce film I take. May be it's the same corner again pointed here.

Hello Ricardo

I like the way you work ,your historical research,its the best way to achieve a "sharp work"
and you have a great mastery of scratch work
good luck for your project
cheers
Nicolas

Let's see if, with a bit of brainstorming, we can come out with an acceptable solution for this ship...

One peculiar aspect of the Pola in respect of her sister ships is the presence of the two light projectors on the main structure just forward of the two side range finders.
The other ship were differently arranged there meaning that probably more space was available up there. My suggestion is that, because of those elements, the bridge enclosing under the main range-finder had to shrink down just after the front observation windows, meaning that structure configuration could resemble more your first version rather that the new one.
The two drawings are totally unrealistic because in the colour one the ship present different aspects at the time (40mm Vikers installed and no 120mm but with an extended upper bridge) meaning it's not a faithful representation of an original Photo.
The second one has (impossibly) a door which opens exactly in front of the quadripod spar which means it's useless and lacks the Light Projectors entirely.
Try dry fitting all the stuff you see in the original pictures on the bridge you have designed and let me know if you do not come the my same conclusion

Gianluigi