ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

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Expand view Topic review: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by sargentx » Mon Jul 20, 2015 12:09 am

In this case, i don't think there is much difference. The product I use is LIquitex High gloss varnish (I"ll also use Liquitex satin varnish on rougher seas). For all intents and purposes, the 'varnish' seems to just be a runnier version of acrylic gloss medium. I like it because it brushes on without any brush-marks, and is extremely shiny as a finish. In an imperfect world where one might not be able to get Liquitex HG varnish, you could use basic golden or liquitex gloss acrylic medium. Same thing, but a little thicker.

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by davidwaples » Sun Jul 19, 2015 11:52 pm

sargentx wrote:HI,
I never use gloss gel. It holds it's peaks and ruins the effect.
To glue down the paper, I use acrylic gloss medium (not gel). For my fine shiny coat, I use a product call Liquitex HIGH gloss varnish. It's identical to acrylic clear medium, but is shinier and runnier in consistency.
Hope that helps.
C
Hi Chris,
What is the difference between "Clear Medium and Varnish" and "Clear Gloss Varnish"? I have the later. Thanks for sharing with us in detail your developing process. I'm trying it now and will be presenting it to our ship club Saturday.

Dave

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by biggles2 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 9:24 am

Ready to dive in! :big_grin:

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by sargentx » Sun Jun 28, 2015 12:59 am

That's exactly what you want. Oat bran is very fine, like large grain grits. You 'can' use quick oats, but I'd sand them thoroughly after they harden. Oat bran is the way to go though. Do examine the possibility of gluing oat bran down onto a surface, then covering that with paper towel. If you do make an oat sea, I recommend finishing it with paper towel regarless. it makes a really nice undulation. Anyway, it's all in my tutorials. Good luck!

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by biggles2 » Sat Jun 27, 2015 4:56 pm

Hi Sergentx; I got a box of Quaker Brand at Loblaw's because that was all they had that specifically said "oat bran". Lots of regular oats; instant oats; porridge, etc. Looks really fine, like coarse sand - is this what you use? Don't want to end up with a sea of porridge! :big_grin:

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by biggles2 » Thu Jun 25, 2015 12:14 pm

Thanks, again! :thumbs_up_1:

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by sargentx » Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:50 am

HI,
I never use gloss gel. It holds it's peaks and ruins the effect.
To glue down the paper, I use acrylic gloss medium (not gel). For my fine shiny coat, I use a product call Liquitex HIGH gloss varnish. It's identical to acrylic clear medium, but is shinier and runnier in consistency.
Hope that helps.
C

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by biggles2 » Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:18 am

Hi! When you mention the use of "regular acrylic medium" to brush directly onto the oats and paper, is this the thinner liquidy stuff? As you're using it mainly as an adhesive, does it matter if it's gloss, or matte? Then use gloss gel after all is dry? :wave_1:

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by biggles2 » Tue Jun 23, 2015 12:24 pm

Thanks! :wave_1:

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by sargentx » Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:39 am

No...but I wouldn't. It's too paper-like and might wrinkle and pulp up. What you want is real paper towel like Bounty or shop towel. Something that can take a fair amount of moisture.

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by biggles2 » Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:17 am

Ever try the crappy coarse, sort of buff colored industrial paper towel, that comes in a continuous roll? Usually used in washroom paper towel dispensers. :wave_1:

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by sargentx » Tue Jun 23, 2015 11:01 am

You're correct...the sanding is very light and selective with the sole purpose of removing tiny grits or projections. Mind you, I do literally a dozen or more coats of artist's gesso onto my paper surface before I do my overall color. The sea surface is literally like a sheet of rubber come painting time. It sands beautifully. When you think you've done enough coats of gesso, do 10 more. I use a medium-fine grade of black wet-dry paper to do my sanding.
If you opt to cover a rough surface with paper or paper towel, it's crucial to ensure that all the lumps and bumps are logical and of the same type and elevation. You don't want one or two weird lumps that stick up. Also, weird holes or pits that are different than the rest of the sea look bad in the end. When I make a sea, I make it for the close up photos I'll be taking later. I really nit-pick the hell out of it with an optivisor at all stages to ensure that it's perfect. The littlest errors ruin the effect for me.

Re: ocean surface photo tutorial paper and oats

by gawrycht » Tue Jun 23, 2015 10:35 am

Chris,
You mention sanding lightly several times ... after the paper towel has hardened if I am reading right. Is it safe to assume you use a very fine grit and the 'light sanding' is only done to know down any high points? Seems as though it would be easy to sand all the way through the paper and into the oats. Do you tend to sand parallel to the wakes you have sculpted or does the direction not really matter?

Really interested in trying this technique for a PBY Catalina that I am building now, and setting it on a base taking off from the water, so I want to make sure I have all the 'tricks' down before I attempt it. Thanks much!

Re: Chris Flodberg realistic ocean surface photo tutorial

by biggles2 » Sat Oct 25, 2014 9:33 am

Thanks! :thumbs_up_1:

Re: Chris Flodberg realistic ocean surface photo tutorial

by sargentx » Fri Oct 24, 2014 11:07 am

I used to build the ocean around my ship. But now, I'm big on cutting a perfect hole first, making the sea, then putting my ship in. Often, any cracks can be simply stuffed with cotton to hide them. A larger gap could be resolved by bridging that are with a bit of paper and painting it. Or you could just cut a new hole and sea.
I like the idea of painting the sea without the hassle of having a ship in it.
these pictures show my seas before a ship is in. None have received any cotton. I do the cotton work before the ship goes in.
Attachments
water01.jpg
water03.jpg

Re: Chris Flodberg realistic ocean surface photo tutorial

by biggles2 » Fri Oct 24, 2014 10:02 am

Thanks. How about the 2nd part of my question? When do you place your model - before or after the water effects? :wave_1:

Re: Chris Flodberg realistic ocean surface photo tutorial

by sargentx » Thu Oct 23, 2014 11:39 am

I don't know...just cheap Superstore paper towel. It has millions of little holes in it. Petrol Gator is correct in that some of the brands can actually help the illusion. I've honestly never had an issue with any brand I've used; but I can see how an aggressive flower pattern or something might persist. I do a dozen or more coats of artist's gesso before I do my sea color. I've found that the more layers you do, the better the sea gets over time. I just keep the sea out and put a coat on whenever I'm bored. Once in a while I'll do a light sand.

The key idea with all of this, regardless of how you go about doing it, is that a gritty texture, covered with some kind of paper produces an undulation. Carving Styrofoam in a very crude way, sanding it lightly and then covering that with paper always works well. It's identical to oats. It's the core concept that matters here; just finding a way of doing it that works for you is the key. I'm constantly tweaking my seas to make them better; it's really an open exploration!

Re: Chris Flodberg realistic ocean surface photo tutorial

by biggles2 » Thu Oct 23, 2014 11:31 am

Hi Sergentx, which name brand of tissue have you found to work best? Do you press in your water-lined ship while the 'water' is still wet, or place the model first on the base and work the oats and tissue around it? :wave_1:

Re: Chris Flodberg realistic ocean surface photo tutorial

by sargentx » Thu Oct 23, 2014 9:17 am

Sometimes the sea becomes something else than intended. I personally think it looks bad if the viewer can detect a solid, lumpy surface 'pretending' to be water. Smooth and undulating trumps lumpy in my books. I'm sure that if you get down low, it looks great. Glad you sorted it out!
C

Re: Chris Flodberg realistic ocean surface photo tutorial

by el Cid » Thu Oct 23, 2014 6:21 am

Ok, good to know it's not just me. So I ended up smearing on a layer of heavy gel to fill the offending paper towel divit texture, then a generous layer of gloss medium to smooth out the more minor artifacts created by my finger in smearing the gel. Looks good, but I've lost much of the oat bran ripply effect...I'll say it went from being a very breezy day to a less breezy day. Next time I may try the tissue paper route, that's what I recall using in elementary school art class.

Cheers,

Keith

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