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PostPosted: Thu Jul 28, 2011 10:28 am 
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Hi all,

The Kaiser class battleships of the German Imperial Navy were the immediate predecessors of the König class. The latter has become reasonably well known since we have got a couple of nice kits from ICM on 1/350 scale. On 1/700 scale the situation is somewhat better thanks to the resin kits from Combrig in particular.

But as 1/350 is my favourite scale I was eager to see if something can be done using the ICM kit as a basis and converting it into a Kaiser class ship. SMS Friedrich der Große, the High Seas Fleet flagship will be my be the objective of this project. On the site of The Dreadnought Project a set of detailed original drawings can be found, and when you know that the frame spacing of these ships was exactly 1200 mm it's a matter of simple math to resize these drawings to 1/350 scale.

First step is to take out a section of 8 mm from the hull, at it's widest point, exactly in the middle between stem and stern. And since the hull is also somewhat too wide for a Kaiser (29 m the width should be), I also scored out a wedge at the keel, 4 mm at the widest point and tapering towards the bow and the stern.
Attachment:
Afbeelding 188a.jpg
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The next step will be to join the parts, adding reinforcing plates to the bottom and the hull sides internally. I will take 1 mm off the rim of the hull, and then new decks will be added, made from 1 mm plastic card, with a layer on top of Evergreen 2020 'Car Siding' plate to simulate the planked deck.

As you want to get an impression, surf to the subject of the Baden/Bayern class battleships, my SMS Baden project has progressed already much further. The Friedrich will be much easier: first the ship is smaller instead of larger than the König, second the main armament turrets can be used from the kit and third the superstructure is much simpler than that of Baden.

To be continued, of course!

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:07 am 
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Hi Maarten,
any update on your conversion project???

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 9:49 am 
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Hi Neptune,

Since last pictures I only cemented the hull together, and made the main deck from 1 mm plastic. And of course a lot of studying of the plans, location of the torpedo tubes, different rudder arrangement of the Kaisers and so forth.

As I'm planning things way ahead mentally, it was fun to discover that the 15cm secondary armament is not distributed symmetrically, but away from the midship primary turrets (B and E), so on starboard you find (front to back) two guns, large space, then five guns, on port it is the other way: five guns, space, then two guns. But the forecastle deck itself is symmetrical. Not all plans I have seen from the Kaisers show this correctly.

Do you have any plans to follow through on this project?

As I'm also doing the SMS Baden at the same time I want to keep the progress on that one going as well.


(PS: I live in Belgium too!)

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 11:18 am 
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oh looks good. I shall follow intently...

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:01 pm 
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Yeah I was planning to follow. I sorta got a love for these WWI German designs, starting from Nassau on. Love those design, but there aren't many people around building those. (which surprises me as they do keep building that Bismarck, which to my opinion isn't all that special or specific :heh: ).
Good luck with your projects in any case!

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 5:54 am 
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Got WSW's SMS Kaiser in 1/700, amazing resin cast and easy to build even for unexperience resin builder, of a wonderful battleship indeed.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:16 am 
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Hi Kaiser class fans!

I can report some progress with my 1:350 ICM kitbash project: SMS Friedrich der Grosse is taking shape nicely.

After I made oval inserts for the submerged torpedo tubes in the right locations, I was ready to fix the deck. The Kaiser had a slightly less freeboard than the Königs, so after I took 1.5 mm off the rim of the hull, I fixed new strips to support the deck at the right level.After adding a layer of Evergreen 2020 v-grooved material to the deck I was ready to cement it in place.

Then on to the forecastle deck: I carefully copied the shape from the drawings (thanks, Dreadnought Prject!) onto another sheet of Evergreen 2020, an cemeted it to a layer of plain 0.5mm sheet. Then a nice puzzle started: taking the battery walls from the kit I juggled with each individual 15 cm gun emplacement, modified or not, to have it fixed nicely below the forecastle deck. In the end you end up with a large gap at eiher side, to be filled in with plain Evergreen strip. I leave the detailing of the walls for later.

Then a quicky: measuring out the right locations for each of the main gun barbettes, and drilling a hole to receive each of those. I put the five trrets in place just for the pictures: of course these need to be detailed also slightly different from the kit versions.

Enjoy the pictures!

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Maarten

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:35 am 
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Fantastic Maarten!

This is something I have to do too! But the deck side above the casemates was not straigth as in the original Vulcan drawing. It had cutouts for the guns.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 3:40 am 
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Hi Mikko,

Thanks! That's an interesting remark, I never spotted that. Do you have any reference that shows those cutouts? I would gladly alter it now on my model.

Apparently you have the same Vulcan yard drawing as I have. As I further only have the Marine-Arsenal book on the Kaisers, could you recommend any further references?

Thanks again,
Maarten

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 4:22 am 
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Nice to see some progress Maarten. Glad you keep us updated. Those casemates and that general shape is the reason I like these ships so much. Guns all around and a robust shape, which you catch really well with your model. The pics have something CAD-ish as well :woo_hoo:

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 12:45 pm 
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Hello Maarten!

I have been trying to contact you via e-mail for pictures and a plan for your project.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:20 am 
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Hi Kaiser fans,

Time to give you an update on my 1:350 Friedrich der Große project.

I added the walkway (cat-walk?) between the superstructures, the anchor cable runs, both from Evergreen strip of 0.25mm thickness and various width. Further I cut out the openings for the many hatches/staircases, and marked all the places for bits and skylights.

Then I was ready to paint the deck, using my preferred method of a base colour of (in this case) Humbrol 103, followed by a wash of artists dark brow oil paint, which was wiped off immediately again, leaving thes seams between the planks dark and tinting the planks themselves nicely. (note: I need to touch-up the planks near the bow).

I also added the basic structures of both superstructures, which need to be detailed further: first step will be adding all the louvres for the boiler room ventilation.

Until the next stage :wave_1:


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 11:50 am 
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Nice one :thumbs_up_1: Maarten .


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PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 1:51 pm 
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Great build there Maarten. :thumbs_up_1:

Watching with Interest :wave_1:

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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2019 6:18 am 
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Hi Maarten
I make fiberglass hulls for RC models here in the US .I am thinking of making SMS Friedrich der Grosse in 1/100 scale and wondering how you are making out with this build in 1/350 .
You have already helped me by stating the frame spacing is 1200mm . Your build could help anyone making the model .
Started the HMS London / Norfolk plug in 1/96 and used the body lines you posted on the Cruiser section . I gave you credit for them on the web site here in the US .
Richard


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PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2019 3:55 pm 
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Richard OMalley wrote:
Hi Maarten
I make fiberglass hulls for RC models here in the US .I am thinking of making SMS Friedrich der Grosse in 1/100 scale and wondering how you are making out with this build in 1/350 .
You have already helped me by stating the frame spacing is 1200mm . Your build could help anyone making the model .
Started the HMS London / Norfolk plug in 1/96 and used the body lines you posted on the Cruiser section . I gave you credit for them on the web site here in the US .
Richard

Hi Richard,

Thank you very much, I am glad my tinkerings are of good use and inspiration to others! As a matter of fact I should make some photo's of my FdG as it has progressed since my last update, masts and superstructures now basically complete.

If you think you need any help getting forward with your plug for a fiberglass version, please let me know, you can get all the references I have used.

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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 12:06 pm 
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As promised, here some update photos. Enjoy!
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PostPosted: Thu May 23, 2019 4:05 pm 
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Hi, Marteen:

I am curious about rudder arrangement on the Kaiser class battleship. Many drawings depict the ship with twin semi-spade rudders with rudder horns, similar to what you have . But image of the Kaiser's upside down salvaged hull in Scapa Flow seem to show two pure spade rudders with no rudder horn, with the rudders angled outwards. This latter arrangement is similar to later German twin rudder capital ships such as Bismarck and Scharnhorst.

I was wondering if you have any other reference photos for the rudder arrangements on these ships.

Image

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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 12:51 am 
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Hi Chuck,

The photo you showed is from the Bayern, under tow in April 1935 by the Dutch tugs 'Zwarte Zee', 'Witte Zee' and 'Ganges', just before passing the Firth of Forth railway bridge on their way to the shipbreakers yard in Rosyth.

The Bayern had spade type rudders, slightly angled outwards, as is in the ICM kit. These rudders were pioneered on the König class.

The Kaiser class though had twin conventional rudders, sitting vertically and being lead by a small skeg.
Attachment:
SMS König Albert rr.jpg
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scan from the book 'Jutland to Junkyard'. Bot look closely, the top right picture is -surprise!- not the König Albert (Kaiser class), but again the 'Bayern'!

Small mistake, upside down these ships are hard to recognize, but the rudders are indeed the giveaway. If you need the drawing details I will make scans of these too.

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PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2019 10:12 am 
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And here the side view of the stern of SMS FdG, from the plan in 'The Dreadnought Project'. Clearly not the spade rudders of the König or Bayern classes. Unfortunately the stern section views are missing, but I'm pretty sure these rudders were vertical, and not canted outwards.
Attachment:
Kaiser class stern sideview.jpg
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And a picture of the rudders and screws of 'König Albert'.
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