WIP - 1/350 USS Lexington (CV-2)

[Rob Jansen]

What struck me as utterly unbelievable is the platforms around the Navigating Bridge: The Saratoga kit Part is correct for the Lexington, and the Lexington correct for the Saratoga!!! It is obvious to me that Trumpeter was using pictures & drawings of both ships and mixing details.

I see that you corrected yours to make it accurate for Lexington; but I'm still trying to decide whether to use my Lexington's or just live with it on my 1940 Sara, beings my plan is to convert the Lex kit to Saratoga anyhow. I would just be putting off the "scratching" until my next project...which will require a nearly complete rebuild of the superstructure anyway...

I really was planning this build to be minimal rework...but I'm beginning to see that not happening...

Thank you for sharing your post with me.

[Guest]

Hi Jim

Been out of touch with your build progress for six months now (been focused on a few commisions), so it was great to get back on your thread and see the progress you're making.

On reflection this rubbish kit is at least eight years old now. Maybe all of us who've sweated blood, guts and tears making a decent fist of it should just club our money together and commission another manufacturer to put together a decent kit of the old girl.

Oh, oh, only joking, it's the CREATIVE investigation, input and scratch building that makes it so rewarding. Just building a perfect moel out of the box would just be - er - so boring.

Without a doubt what I started you will finish - the most perfect model of the Lady Lex. But don't you go dying before you finish it, or I'll kill you!

Humble respect and best regards, Chris

[lvsquarerigger]

Dying is not on the agenda for a loooooong time yet Chris.

[Guest]

I'm interested to know what your long-term thinking is around how you might display this model. I know you're building it full-hull. But in my humble opinion, a full hull model on stands/pillars is often - er - dead.

If you populate it with a full deck load of planes, bring it to life with crew, set it in its natural environment of water, that to me somehow sets the whole context of not just the ship as a piece of naval architecture, but expresses the whole gamut of its military and social setting.

Because I know your Dad was a crew member, is there some sense in in capturing the life of the crew as well? You could even work your Dad into it somewhere! As an example (not preaching, just thoughts), in my build I created a lot of small scenarios of crew members interacting with each other, just as they would have done in real life. Exasperated plane captains coaxing lazy fuelers and munitions parties into stop lazing around scuttlebutting but get on with the job. Black mess servants sharing a cigarette or two on the 5-inch bow gun platforms adjacent to the officers' mess. Officers coming aboard in ships boats, climbing bridge ladders readying the ship to get underway.

Could your incredible model not be on water - maybe moored, or alongside a jetty? I'd love to see your model come to life - be more than just a miniature perfect replica of a piece of naval architecture. I'm sure you get my drift by now.

Best regards, Chris

[lvsquarerigger]

Yeah I get your drift Chris. I haven't ever done water and not sure I'm ready for that. I envisioned her underway, a bone in her teeth, planes on deck and safety nets up. Not sure if I'm going to put her on a couple of spindles, a bed of wood. or just what but the time to decide is close as it will soon be time to put on the flight deck and if I'm going to use spindles I have to make some kind of attachment before I do that.

James

[Christian M.]

I'm interested to know what your long-term thinking is around how you might display this model. I know you're building it full-hull. But in my humble opinion, a full hull model on stands/pillars is often - er - dead.

If you populate it with a full deck load of planes, bring it to life with crew, set it in its natural environment of water, that to me somehow sets the whole context of not just the ship as a piece of naval architecture, but expresses the whole gamut of its military and social setting.

Because I know your Dad was a crew member, is there some sense in in capturing the life of the crew as well? You could even work your Dad into it somewhere! As an example (not preaching, just thoughts), in my build I created a lot of small scenarios of crew members interacting with each other, just as they would have done in real life. Exasperated plane captains coaxing lazy fuelers and munitions parties into stop lazing around scuttlebutting but get on with the job. Black mess servants sharing a cigarette or two on the 5-inch bow gun platforms adjacent to the officers' mess. Officers coming aboard in ships boats, climbing bridge ladders readying the ship to get underway.

Could your incredible model not be on water - maybe moored, or alongside a jetty? I'd love to see your model come to life - be more than just a miniature perfect replica of a piece of naval architecture. I'm sure you get my drift by now.

Best regards, Chris

Hello Chris,
Sure, inside such a display a model looks maybe more alive as on pillars and full hull, but beside the fact the it depends how good the water base it made (this isn't easy to make and excellent models are sometimes imbedded into lousy "water" displays, sorry), it is also a task of personal view.
I know that majority makes models on displays but I prefer for example full hull models on pillars and in my opinion it shows the complete model without castrated hull. This does not mean I will never make on display too, for example I will make for sure at my coming BB-3 USS Oregon in 1/350 because I got the waterline version of the kit, but at least you can not argue about matter of taste.

Cheers,
Christian

[lvsquarerigger]

Haven't posted any progress because there hadn't been any until today. I wanted to paint the seams around the boat pockets but I do not have indoor space, space of any kind is severely lacking until we find a bigger house, so must play the vagaries of the weather gods who have not been very cooperative, bringing lots of wind or rain. Granted we really need all the rain we can get but a small break of some kind would have been nice. Caught a brief window this morning and did do the boat pockets and also finished the 5" guns. With paint there is one small area that still needs sanding and filling but I'm really happy with the results considering how much I tore up and replaced. The boat pockets are all in and I sprayed a section of rail this morning for the last little pieces on the platforms where they come out for the ladders from the flight deck. With that said here are some pics.

James

[Guest]

What did you make the 5-inch guns from?

Chris

[Guest]

Yeah I get your drift Chris. I haven't ever done water and not sure I'm ready for that. I envisioned her underway, a bone in her teeth, planes on deck and safety nets up. Not sure if I'm going to put her on a couple of spindles, a bed of wood. or just what but the time to decide is close as it will soon be time to put on the flight deck and if I'm going to use spindles I have to make some kind of attachment before I do that.

James

Actually mate, making decent water isn't that difficult. I was terrified the first time, but it was great fun and worked out really well. It's a walk in the park compared with the effort you've been puttng in on the ship.

Jim Bauman and others have some great tips here:

http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... /water.pdf
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... swater.htm
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... ater21.htm
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... ater22.htm
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... mwater.htm
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... swater.htm

And here's my first attempt at water: http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/gall ... jaguar.htm

Don't be scared. Iit'll bring your model to life!

Regards, Chris

[Guest]

I'm interested to know what your long-term thinking is around how you might display this model. I know you're building it full-hull. But in my humble opinion, a full hull model on stands/pillars is often - er - dead.

If you populate it with a full deck load of planes, bring it to life with crew, set it in its natural environment of water, that to me somehow sets the whole context of not just the ship as a piece of naval architecture, but expresses the whole gamut of its military and social setting.

Because I know your Dad was a crew member, is there some sense in in capturing the life of the crew as well? You could even work your Dad into it somewhere! As an example (not preaching, just thoughts), in my build I created a lot of small scenarios of crew members interacting with each other, just as they would have done in real life. Exasperated plane captains coaxing lazy fuelers and munitions parties into stop lazing around scuttlebutting but get on with the job. Black mess servants sharing a cigarette or two on the 5-inch bow gun platforms adjacent to the officers' mess. Officers coming aboard in ships boats, climbing bridge ladders readying the ship to get underway.

Could your incredible model not be on water - maybe moored, or alongside a jetty? I'd love to see your model come to life - be more than just a miniature perfect replica of a piece of naval architecture. I'm sure you get my drift by now.

Best regards, Chris

Hello Chris,
Sure, inside such a display a model looks maybe more alive as on pillars and full hull, but beside the fact the it depends how good the water base it made (this isn't easy to make and excellent models are sometimes imbedded into lousy "water" displays, sorry), it is also a task of personal view.
I know that majority makes models on displays but I prefer for example full hull models on pillars and in my opinion it shows the complete model without castrated hull. This does not mean I will never make on display too, for example I will make for sure at my coming BB-3 USS Oregon in 1/350 because I got the waterline version of the kit, but at least you can not argue about matter of taste.

Cheers,
Christian

Hi Christian,
An interesting debate, but one which I feel has already been settled. Just look at what the military modelling guys, model railway modellers, and even aircraft modellers are doing. Dioramas all - environments, people, dirt, grime, action. It's not about making 'stuff' but about 'telling stories'.

And if the water is lousy, then time to get better at making water, not reject it.

However, I agree that one can't argue about 'taste'. Neverthess, that should not be an excuse for taking a view or an attitude. Anyway, good luck with your waterline models!

Regards, Chris

[lvsquarerigger]

Combination of kit base, L'Arsenal barrel, and GMM PE.

[lvsquarerigger]

Yeah I get your drift Chris. I haven't ever done water and not sure I'm ready for that. I envisioned her underway, a bone in her teeth, planes on deck and safety nets up. Not sure if I'm going to put her on a couple of spindles, a bed of wood. or just what but the time to decide is close as it will soon be time to put on the flight deck and if I'm going to use spindles I have to make some kind of attachment before I do that.

James

Actually mate, making decent water isn't that difficult. I was terrified the first time, but it was great fun and worked out really well. It's a walk in the park compared with the effort you've been puttng in on the ship.

Jim Bauman and others have some great tips here:

http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... /water.pdf
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... swater.htm
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... ater21.htm
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... ater22.htm
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... mwater.htm
http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/tips ... swater.htm

And here's my first attempt at water: http://www.finewaterline.com/pages/gall ... jaguar.htm

Don't be scared. Iit'll bring your model to life!

Regards, Chris

It's not fear it's wondering if I'm ready for that much more than I've already committed to this poor beast of a kit.

[lvsquarerigger]

Had a little time and started to fix the one area that the seam wasn't right. Made a discovery as I started to use a utility blade to scrape down the high spot. It wasn't high, it wasn't fully glued in. When I would sand it would go down and I didn't see this but when I used a blade to scrape I could see the area moving. So I first used the very thin watery ca to glue it down as this would seep in the seam and then filled it with putty. Then it was wet sand it and it came out really good. Fingers can't even detect the edge so it should look good when painted. The next step is, again, the 5" gun platforms. Some new info, picture in Squadron at sea, has a clear shot of the starboard forward ones and you can see the round hole grating on the fold up part and wood decking on the non-movable part. So you know how this affects me and it has to change. I found some plastruct wood planking at the local hobby store so that covers that but L'Arsenal is currently out of the round hole grating. Also a picture of the Lex as she goes through the Panama canal shows the rear ones have a more slotted grating in the movable section. Not sure how I'm going to do that yet but be sure it will change. I have thoughts of cutting the round hole decking when it's finally in stock but will have to wait and see if that works. Now it's a question of how far back do I do my destruction to get the wood deck in and how will I do the movable sections?

[Guest]

You've got to put your Dad on the deck somewhere, as a tribute to him.

Hey, if you do put this beauty on water, bone in her teeth, I'm sure a man of your calibre could figure out a way of suspending taking off aircraft from invisible thread from somewhere invisible above! That would be a first. Not sure here whether I'm pulling your torpecker or inserting an idea.

Best, Chris

[Rob Jansen]

James,
Wait, why: "And the next area to blow-up"!!!! are you building 1942/Coral Sea, or is that just something I assumed? What you have looks right to me...

[lvsquarerigger]

Yes and no. '42 Coral Sea yes but also the deck doesn't show in those photos. So looking at older pics the wooden deck shows up on the forward platforms but not the rear ones. the rounded projecting section, that also folds up for transiting the Panama Canal, has a round hole decking while the rear ones have a more slotted appearance. I'm assuming that as the splinter shielding was added it was just put over what existed. Could be wrong but that's my assumption.

[Rob Jansen]

When Saratoga was rebuilt in early 42' the photos clearly show that the decks were totally replaced; however that would be speculation as far as Lexington is concerned. That being said though, really double check. There is a clearer picture of the one you have above in Squadrons new Lexington book as well as a good shot in the Saratoga book that strongly suggest that what you are seeing is rows of rivets on a steel deck v.s. a wood deck. There are remarkably few good pictures of this area though. LOL I say leave it be my friend!!! no one can prove you wrong

[lvsquarerigger]

Haven't seen anything in any of the books, From Stearn to Squadron at Sea, that mentions any deck work other than widening the flight deck, adding some on the funnel, and modifying the boat deck when the 20MM were added. What I do have is a couple of pics of the fold up sections as she transits the canal and one from Squadron at Sea that is about the AA sponson forward but clearly shows the folded up deck section. My thought was that there areas were made open with railings and that when splinter shielding was added they would just leave the rest as is. Also the one pic clearly shows the wooden deck on the forward section but I haven't been able to find anything that shows this in the rear areas.

So I have removed the port side down to deck level and have tried a couple of variants that did not work to my satisfaction. First up was some railroad car sheet goods but I didn't like it. Then decided to groove some sheet styrene but didn't the like the results on either piece I made. So now I'm in the process of gluing strips on thin sheet and seeing how that works. Also I haven't been really comfortable with the splinter shielding even though it has been done several times. I think this time I'm going to try using sheet brass and see how that works.

Meanwhile here are three pics that show what I'm talking about and I'll post pics of the results whenever I get it sorted out.

James

[Guest]

Haven't seen anything in any of the books, From Stearn to Squadron at Sea, that mentions any deck work other than widening the flight deck, adding some on the funnel, and modifying the boat deck when the 20MM were added. What I do have is a couple of pics of the fold up sections as she transits the canal and one from Squadron at Sea that is about the AA sponson forward but clearly shows the folded up deck section. My thought was that there areas were made open with railings and that when splinter shielding was added they would just leave the rest as is. Also the one pic clearly shows the wooden deck on the forward section but I haven't been able to find anything that shows this in the rear areas.

So I have removed the port side down to deck level and have tried a couple of variants that did not work to my satisfaction. First up was some railroad car sheet goods but I didn't like it. Then decided to groove some sheet styrene but didn't the like the results on either piece I made. So now I'm in the process of gluing strips on thin sheet and seeing how that works. Also I haven't been really comfortable with the splinter shielding even though it has been done several times. I think this time I'm going to try using sheet brass and see how that works.

Meanwhile here are three pics that show what I'm talking about and I'll post pics of the results whenever I get it sorted out.

James

Looking at the second image of the three - the stern 5-inch gallery - I think these are maybe NOT slotted holes, but circular holes just like the gratings for the forward galleries. I think the poor resolution of the image and the grainines has distorted the image to give the impresseion of slotted (elongated holes). Just look at the platform on the extreme right of the picture - the holes look cicular.

Chris

[lvsquarerigger]

Good catch Chris. I have an idea of how to make the open grating and was sweating the slotted ones but now that doesn't seem necessary.

Thanks

James