Calling all Russian submarine fans

[Vepr157]

Iron Outlaw,

forums.airbase.ru is a great site for pictures of Russian submarines. I don't know if you've stumbled across this thread yet, but it might help with your Akula project http://forums.airbase.ru/2009/01/t65532 ... -971m.html. This site is also really good http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-273.html. The picture of the Sierra I is pretty cool. I have an image of the same boat out of the water (I believe it's the Kostroma)
http://i.imgur.com/J3YgBED.jpg


Jacob

[Ironoutlaw]

Many thanks Vepr 157, I'll follow them up.

Obviously for a model that will be transported by trailer and launched from same, which is also likely to run into things and get a bit klnocked around, the exquisit detail that many on this site achieve on much smaller models will not even be attempted. However, it is a fun model to build and, as you might expect, I am learning a lot about how real subs are designed to work.

Cheers

[Brad-M]

Hey Guys,

Back to the HB Akula, I've checked some drawings/pics, and I am thinking that the conning tower/sail is from the Geppard. The front part is longer than the regular Akulas. Anyone have any thoughts? I chose the drawing that has the 4 color plates on it and if you compare the kit's conning tower to the Geppard drawing/color plate, you'll see what I mean. Here's the drawing:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... 1klein.png

Brad

[Vepr157]

Hey Guys,

Back to the HB Akula, I've checked some drawings/pics, and I am thinking that the conning tower/sail is from the Geppard. The front part is longer than the regular Akulas. Anyone have any thoughts? I chose the drawing that has the 4 color plates on it and if you compare the kit's conning tower to the Geppard drawing/color plate, you'll see what I mean. Here's the drawing:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... 1klein.png

Brad

That particular drawing is not very accurate. Here are some I made that are much more accurate:

Typical Akula I Improved (Tigr, Kuzbass, Samara)
http://i.imgur.com/BQG5EXF.png


Akula III (K-335 Gepard)
http://i.imgur.com/x0HT7TR.png


The Gepard's sail is not only longer, it's taller and thinner with straighter sides. Every Akula has the exact same sail (apart from the installation of SOKS) except for Gepard. IMO, the HB Akula looks like a cross between the two. Besides, the shape of the aft hull looks off to me. Doesn't have enough of a tapering curve. What is it about the Akula that is so hard for manufacturers to make a good one. The Alanger, Bronco and Hobby Boss Akulas are all pretty inaccurate. I think I'll save up for the Polar Bear models version.

Edit: Here are some other diagrams I found (not my illustrations). The Gepard drawing is more accurate in terms of torpedo tubes.

Akula I
http://i.imgur.com/beUsEgC.png


Akula II (K-335 Gepard)
http://i.imgur.com/sBmzkUN.png


Jacob

[Ironoutlaw]

Vepre157

Many thanks for the drawings mate.

I have been following up those links you posted and I was wondering if you can advise how to register on the forums.airbase.ru site? I clicked on the log in button hoping it would give me an option to register but no luck. Whilst I dabble with the Russian language, I am no way competent to read or speak it. Thus I cannot identify a place to register. Also, would they accept a non Russian speaking subscriber?

Take care and keep well

Cheers

[Brad-M]

Hi Vepr,

So what are you basing your drawings on? I do realize that the color plate I posted isn't that great, but I am wondering what yours are based on.

Brad

[Vepr157]

Iron Outlaw, I'm not sure how to register as I just lurk. I only know a few words of Russian (the words for submarine, navy, torpedo, those kinds of things), but I use google translate to make sense of most of it. If you use Chrome, it will automatically translate the webpage for you. I looked briefly and there's a button for registering near the top.

Brad, I used a combination of sources to draw my illustrations. For the main shape of the submarine, I was actually able to find official drawings from the design bureau that designed the Akula, Malakhit. For the details I used some other (unofficial) drawings I found online plus added some details that I saw in photos. I can't guarantee that my diagrams are 100% accurate for the small details, but I'm confident that they are accurate in terms of the shapes of the large features like the hull, sail and control surfaces. Here's official drawing from Malakhit of K-157 Vepr':

http://i.imgur.com/Co9vRE7.jpg


Jacob

[Brad-M]

Thanks Vepr, those are much nicer. Would you happen to know the real length of each boat, Geppard and the Akula I improved?

Brad

[Vepr157]

Brad,

According to a Russian book I have and http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-273.html, the length of the Akula I and Akula I Improved (i.e. all the Akulas except Vepr' and Gepard) is 110.3 meters. Vepr' and Gepard are 113.3 meters long.

Jacob

[Brad-M]

Thanks Jacob

Brad

[krgf15]

Vepr, thats an awesome website!!

[Brad-M]

Hi Neptune,

Any idea which version of the Akula is in picture number 5? The lumber holes in the HB kit look like the ones in this photo.

Thanks
Brad

At your service.

Not entirely true Tom.
Also in the link they mention that the later Akula's don't have it, which is completely wrong. The last true Akula was Gepard, before her were Tigr and Vepr, all three have SOKS in full configuration (although slightly differing, as ever in this class).
The only one after that, Nerpa, is not really an Akula, it's completed for India, you can clearly see it's an export "monkey version" like in good old USSR. They have simply welded over (well more "plated over" as there were never holes, but you can see the underlying tubes through the steel plating) the six 533mm tubes, they gave her the old big tear drop shaped towed array sonar, where the Gepard has Pelamida (as well as all the later built/upgraded ships like Dolgoruky, Borei, Severodvinsk), so Pelamida is definately the Russian Navy No 1 choice. And last but not least they left out the SOKS on the India boat, not because it's not working anymore, but just because they don't want to hand it over to anybody (or the manufacturer simply doesn't exist anymore).
Arguably the Severodvinsk SSN doesn't have SOKS (in a visible form at least), but perhaps that is due to the above mentioned reason of not having it manufactured anymore.

Anyway, here are some pics of the thing as well as the Akula in general shape. Enjoy.

Drop shaped sensors:




The top part, which according to Tom's link, could be for calibration, seems to change from ship to ship. This appears to be an early version, later ones have more antennae mounted there. The antennae are the same as the ones mounted in those fin-type sensors.




Notice the fin on the right of the pic, you can estimate its size by the lifebouy standing next to it.


Notice the sensors on portside lower hull, 1 fin and 3 drop shapes again.


Notice starboard side sensors, the fin with some snow on it, drop shapes behind it.


Notice the forward diving plane as well as the SOKS sensors. (and of course the trashed forward part, they seemed to work or change the bow sonar, the "cut" doesn't seem to be very straight or professional though)

[Vepr157]

Brad,

I don't mean to steal Neptune's thunder, but that Akula is K-480 Ak Bars. She's an Akula I, so she has the same limber holes as all the other Akula Is. The thing that sets Ak Bars apart are her unique SOKS sensors. They are the earlier MNK-200 sensors instead of the MNK-200-1 sensors used on the other Akulas that have SOKS. She also has guards protecting the SOKS sensors, but they are unique to her.

I wouldn't try too hard to identify which Akula Hobby Boss is trying to make because they seem to have made a very inaccurate amalgam of all the Akula variants.

Jacob

[Brad-M]

Hi Jacob,

I am just trying to figure out how to build this kit to as close to an Improved Akula I as I can. If I need to add or delete stuff, then I'll try my best to do so.

Thanks for the reply.

Brad

[Ironoutlaw]

Hi folks

A question on the Snoop Pair [MRKP-58 Radian] sensors on the Akulas. I have seen images of this sensor showing one eliptical dish on top of the mast and other images of 2 eliptical dishes back to back on top. Also mentioned in references are Snoop Half and Rim Hat, the latter being atop Snoop Pair.

Can any members qualify which is which, and maybe even which Akulas have which sensors?

Another query about SOKS sensors on the forward edge of the fin. There seems to be a variety of types with Nerpa, in Indian Navy service having none. Most images suggest 10 probes but Ak Bars appears to have a capacity for 12 probes.

If anyone can advise what the boats might carry I'd be most grateful. I do appreciate that these things may change with upgrades over time, but my main reason for asking concerns Samara in her latest guise.

Many thanks

Cheers

[Vepr157]

Ironoutlaw,

The following Akulas have the MRKP-58 Radian: Akula, Barnaul, Kashalot, Bratsk, Pantera, Magadan and Kuzbass (probably). These Akulas have the MRKP-59 Radian-U: Ak Bars (probably), Volk, Leopard, Tigr, Samara, Vepr', Gepard and Nerpa. The MRKP-58 has two parabolic antennae and the MRKP-59 has one, but otherwise, they are the same.

As for SOKS, all the submarines that have them have holes for 10 sensor probes on the front of the sail. Pantera, Tigr and Gepard currently only have two probes (the top left and right-most probes), with the rest of the holes filled in. Perhaps they figured out that they only need two of them on the sail. The rest that have SOKS, to my knowledge, currently have all 10, including Samara. Ak Bars is an interesting case because she has steel guards around her probes that look like probes themselves. I'm not sure why this is the case, but she does have the earlier version of SOKS which probably has to do with her being the first Akula to be made in Severodvinsk instead of Komsomolsk'.

Jacob

[Ironoutlaw]

Many thanks for that info Jacob.

Can you tell me the visible difference between the MRKP-58 and the MRKP-59?

Cheers

[Brad-M]

58 has 2 radar antenna and 59 only has one.

Brad

[Brad-M]

So far I have built the HB Victor III, and the Alfa, and now I am building the Akula, and I can't believe the difference in size of the Akula. It can practically swallow the Alfa whole. I've been in the Canadian Navy for 32 years, I am the Sonar Chief Petty Officer at our Naval school, and I had no idea of the size of this submarine. Incredible.

Brad

[Vepr157]

They are deceptively large. Even though they are the same length as the Los Angeles class, they are almost twice the submerged displacement. Heck, even the Polaris boomers were smaller.